First published in print: Thursday, November 5, 2009 How's this for, like, a totally "wow" moment:
Guitarist John Kadlecik plays the Jerry Garcia part in the acclaimed Grateful Dead tribute band Dark Star Orchestra. This is a critically acclaimed band that reproduces full live Dead shows. The Chicago Tribune even once said the band "recreates the Dead concert experience with uncanny verisimilitude. ... In fact, Dark Star Orchestra often sounds more like the Dead than the Dead sometimes did."
OK, but here's the wow part: A couple of Grateful Dead founding members -- Phil Lesh and Bob Weir, to be exact -- are pulling together a new band called Furthur.
And who did they tap to be the guitarist? Why none other than Dark Star Orchestra's own Kadlecik.
Weir, who once shared a stage with Dark Star Orchestra, said of that experience: "A couple of times when I had my back to John (Kadlecik) onstage and he started to sing, I had this weird sense that it was Jerry."
Furthur has some dates lined up in December, and those dates will take Kadlecik away from Dark Star Orchestra, but his publicists have confirmed that he will be playing with the band on Friday at the Palace Theatre in Albany.
Neil X wrote: > DG wrote: >> John is the real deal. I am glad that they finally have a guitarist >> who knows how to play the music.
> You misspelled "soullessly copy the music."
The "soulless copy" is what I took away from the times I saw Dark Star Orchestra. It was great fun, a good time, a nice evening of shaking the bones with like-minded folks, but at the core a little bit ... creepy weird. Just a little.
Have you seen Furthur ? I mean, I'm just wondering if John might be different in a different setting ?
Has anyone talked to the Filipino Steve Perry about all this? Don't stop believin', hold on to that feeeeeeaaaaaaaayyyyyylllllllllliiiiiaaaaaaaaayyyyyyyyiiiiinnnnn...
I don't care that he copies Garcia. I don't care that he has no soul but imitates JG's phrasing. I DO care that he has no fucking tone whatsoever!!!!!!
> >I don't care that he copies Garcia. I don't care that he has no soul > >but imitates JG's phrasing. I DO care that he has no fucking tone > >whatsoever!!!!!!
> You also don't seem to care about proving your idiocy.
>>Neil X wrote: >>> DG wrote: >>>> John is the real deal. I am glad that they finally have a guitarist >>>> who knows how to play the music.
>>> You misspelled "soullessly copy the music."
>>The "soulless copy" is what I took away from the times I saw >>Dark Star Orchestra. It was great fun, a good time, a nice >>evening of shaking the bones with like-minded folks, but at >>the core a little bit ... creepy weird. Just a little.
>I love DSO. They are excellent musicians who perform the music I >enjoy.
>>Have you seen Furthur ? I mean, I'm just wondering if John >>might be different in a different setting ?
>Get yourself a copy of the soundboards and listen for yourself. >http://bt.etree.org/?searches=furthur&cat=0 >The 9/18 matrix is excellent. The 9/19 and 9/20 boards are great.
>Given the amount of times I've seen/heard John play, I think he was >holding back during these shows. I bet he blows the roof off when he >gets a bit more comfortable.
<snip>
Yeah, I gotta disagree with Neil on the lack of soul thing. I can definitely hear the passion in his playing with Furthur (I'd never really listened to DSO before), although I agree he sounds a bit restrained. I missed those Jerry shreds, but I would also expect he'll let loose with a few more shows under his belt.
> >>The "soulless copy" is what I took away from the times I saw > >>Dark Star Orchestra. It was great fun, a good time, a nice > >>evening of shaking the bones with like-minded folks, but at > >>the core a little bit ... creepy weird. Just a little.
> >I love DSO. They are excellent musicians who perform the music I > >enjoy.
> >>Have you seen Furthur ? I mean, I'm just wondering if John > >>might be different in a different setting ?
> >Get yourself a copy of the soundboards and listen for yourself. > >http://bt.etree.org/?searches=furthur&cat=0 > >The 9/18 matrix is excellent. The 9/19 and 9/20 boards are great.
> >Given the amount of times I've seen/heard John play, I think he was > >holding back during these shows. I bet he blows the roof off when he > >gets a bit more comfortable.
> <snip>
> Yeah, I gotta disagree with Neil on the lack of soul thing.
Yeah, especially considering his championing of a sclub like LC, nevermind P&F in general, as whatever merits they might have, they are pretty much devoid of soul.
>On Nov 5, 8:53 pm, JimK <jkezw...@comcast.net> wrote:
>> >>> You misspelled "soullessly copy the music."
>> >>The "soulless copy" is what I took away from the times I saw >> >>Dark Star Orchestra. It was great fun, a good time, a nice >> >>evening of shaking the bones with like-minded folks, but at >> >>the core a little bit ... creepy weird. Just a little.
>> >I love DSO. They are excellent musicians who perform the music I >> >enjoy.
>> >>Have you seen Furthur ? I mean, I'm just wondering if John >> >>might be different in a different setting ?
>> >Get yourself a copy of the soundboards and listen for yourself. >> >http://bt.etree.org/?searches=furthur&cat=0 >> >The 9/18 matrix is excellent. The 9/19 and 9/20 boards are great.
>> >Given the amount of times I've seen/heard John play, I think he was >> >holding back during these shows. I bet he blows the roof off when he >> >gets a bit more comfortable.
>> <snip>
>> Yeah, I gotta disagree with Neil on the lack of soul thing.
>Yeah, especially considering his championing of a sclub like LC, >nevermind P&F in general, as whatever merits they might have, they are >pretty much devoid of soul.
>Fred
I would disagree about P&F, too. Although the soul wasn't always there in spades, it was usually there.
On Nov 5, 6:34 pm, Ken Fortenberry <kennethfortenbe...@gmail.com> wrote:
> Neil X wrote: > > DG wrote: > >> John is the real deal. I am glad that they finally have a guitarist > >> who knows how to play the music.
> > You misspelled "soullessly copy the music."
> The "soulless copy" is what I took away from the times I saw > Dark Star Orchestra. It was great fun, a good time, a nice > evening of shaking the bones with like-minded folks, but at > the core a little bit ... creepy weird. Just a little.
The guy in the Dylan tribute band (Hwy 61 Revisited) is the king of creepy.
> >> > "A couple of times when I had my back to John (Kadlecik) onstage and > >> >he started to sing, I had this weird sense that it was Jerry."
> >> >-The thin man has been hanging around Wendy again. It's the damned > >> >banyan trees.
> >> John is the real deal. I am glad that they finally have a guitarist > >> who knows how to play the music.
> > You misspelled "soullessly copy the music."
> >HTH, > >Neil X.
> Nonsense... Try the soundboards of 9/18-20 and open your ears. John > is a top musician and can perform Jerry Garcia music better than > anyone.
I have listened to the 9/20 show several times now. The Cassidy jam is great as are the vocals on DS. All I can say is I like. I think there is room for improvement, but I think the greatest asset John brings is practice in playing with other musicians who are playing in the style of the GD. It is like you cannot run a marathon if you practice by swimming. I really don't think he sounds like Jerry, actually I hear more Anastasio in his playing. He is a keeper.
> On Nov 5, 4:24 pm, DG <nos...@nospam.nospammmm> wrote: >> "mr. bear" <yourcbm...@gmail.com> wrote:
>> ><SNIP> >> >Did you dig this part:
>> > "A couple of times when I had my back to John (Kadlecik) onstage and >> >he started to sing, I had this weird sense that it was Jerry."
>> >-The thin man has been hanging around Wendy again. It's the damned >> >banyan trees.
>> John is the real deal. I am glad that they finally have a guitarist >> who knows how to play the music.
> You misspelled "soullessly copy the music."
> HTH, > Neil X.
Yeah, I hear you. I'd much rather hear Phil and Friends. So what if Phil can't sing. The incessant noodling and lead guitarists that have no idea how to play the catalog is okay because dammit, they have sole.
I left a Phil and Friends show at Great Woods some years ago around 10:40 knowing it was curfew time. Phil was singing Terrapin. Sounded like a 40- year old milk cow trying courageously to shake overly-tightened Vise Grips off its tats. That was sole! I was trying to help Bessy.
> >> >I don't care that he copies Garcia. I don't care that he has no soul > >> >but imitates JG's phrasing. I DO care that he has no fucking tone > >> >whatsoever!!!!!!
> >> You also don't seem to care about proving your idiocy.
Nonsense...his tone is razor thin. He's an imitator who tries desperately to become Garcia, and it's a waste of time. That's what has made all the others so much fun...they are themselves, not Garcia copycats...but i understand many deadheads want to hear Jerry play again...ugghhhh.....
> John understands Garcia better than anyone. You don't get "it"... Run > along child...
My take on this is that Grateful Dead music isn't some magical potion that has been put high on a shelf just out of reach of mortal man. It's not cookie cutting music either where you can do the note for note cover band thing. It's about improv, taking changes, new arrangements, and finding your own voice in the music. You can't recreate what is gone. I'm not looking for a new Jerry. When I go see Ratdog. I'm going for a Ratdog experience not a Dead one. When I see Phil and Friends I'm going for a Phil and Friends experience not Dead one. The Ratdog shows with Kimock were amazing and Karan has had his moments. One of my favorate Phil and Friends line ups was that summer tour he did with Campbell,Osborne,Sless, with Trey and Sco sitting in at a few shows. More steller stuff. There are many paths up the mountain to musical bliss. Grateful Dead music isn't about being dogmatic about how it should be played. If you like any of the "left overs" musical vision your not disrespecting Jerryand have to burn in hell. No doubt the guy from DSO loves the music of the Grateful Dead nad has a soul but so do the 1000s of other guitarist playing in the many Grateful Dead "cover" bands across the country. How do you measure one's understanding of Garcia? I played keyboards in a Grateful Dead "cover" band and we have discussions on what we are trying to do. We all bring our influences to the table and play with passion which has been working out very well so far. The people who come to see us have various opinions on what we sound like etc... but it's not a recreation of a Grateful Dead experiences.
> > > "A couple of times when I had my back to John (Kadlecik) onstage and > > >he started to sing, I had this weird sense that it was Jerry."
> > >-The thin man has been hanging around Wendy again. It's the damned > > >banyan trees.
> > John is the real deal. I am glad that they finally have a guitarist > > who knows how to play the music.
> You misspelled "soullessly copy the music."
> HTH, > Neil X.
You know, I had this same attitude at one point, but I've talking to a few friends that went to the recent Further shows (folks that can't stand DSO in fact), and they all came away impressed. Is this nostalgia? Absolutely. But it sounded fun enough for me to buy tickets for the 30th. I won't now start attending DSO shows, but with Bobby and Phil playing together with an energetic rhythm section (they sounded great via the footage I saw), why not check this unit out?
Get on out here Neil. I'd bet you'd have fun at the shows. All the skeptics I talked to were had positive things to say.
That said, I've never agreed with you that Phil is making 'cutting edge' music. But you have the right to be wrong. ;-)
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