BRAHMS Piano Quartets 1 & 2 Pristine Audio PACM 066
Trio Santoliquido: Ornella Puliti Santoliquido, piano Arrigo Pelliccia, violin Massimo Amfitheatroff, cello with Bruno Giuranna, viola (N.B. This ensemble appeared on some issues as the "Quartteto di Roma") Recorded 1958
All original stereo LP discs from the Pristine Audio collection Transfers and XR remastering by Andrew Rose at Pristine Audio, October - November 2009
These were recorded August 1958 in the Beethoven-Saal (Hannover). Weren't reviewed in 'Gramophone' until June/July 1959 - and my first edition gatefold (printed1/59) copy of 138 015 shows it wasn't mastered until February 1959...therefore 1959 publication.
You'd have to leave it to January next year before releasing your, eh, 'restoration' ...but... you're-the-copyright-expert ...
> These were recorded August 1958 in the Beethoven-Saal (Hannover). > Weren't reviewed in 'Gramophone' until June/July 1959 - and my first > edition gatefold (printed1/59) copy of 138 015 shows it wasn't > mastered until February 1959...therefore 1959 publication.
> You'd have to leave it to January next year before releasing your, eh, > 'restoration' ...but... you're-the-copyright-expert ...
Printed on the back of the 1st edition gatefold LP sleeve for SLPM 138014: "12/58"
The best (only) information I'd managed to find on recording dates was "early 1958" for both.
(I used a later issue of SLPM 138015 so there was a certain degree of assumption/guesswork involved here)
As such I'm working with the best information I have available to me. If I hear from DGG that some of this does indeed breach copyright then I'll withdraw it for the next six and a half weeks...
But hey, frankwm, when have you ever missed an opportunity to knock our releases, one way or another?
-- Andrew Rose
Pristine Classical: "The destination for people interested in historic recordings..." (Gramophone)
>But hey, frankwm, when have you ever missed an opportunity to knock our >releases, one way or another?
'Just The Facts, Ma'am'....
If you look inside your copy of 138 014, and upon reading the text, you will see the recording location/date shown..betcha.. Also - check on the matrix (you're supposed to have 'learnt' this bit, by now...!!).
'B9' would indicate mastered Feb 59 - A9 =Jan 1959 - so both LPs could be in copyright!
My other early DGG SLPM gatefolds carry date/location, BTW..
> Trio Santoliquido: > Ornella Puliti Santoliquido, piano > Arrigo Pelliccia, violin > Massimo Amfitheatroff, cello > with Bruno Giuranna, viola > (N.B. This ensemble appeared on some issues as the "Quartteto di Roma") > Recorded 1958
> All original stereo LP discs from the Pristine Audio collection > Transfers and XR remastering by Andrew Rose at Pristine Audio, October - > November 2009
> >But hey, frankwm, when have you ever missed an opportunity to knock our >>releases, one way or another?
> 'Just The Facts, Ma'am'....
> If you look inside your copy of 138 014, and upon reading the text, > you will see the recording location/date shown..betcha.. > Also - check on the matrix (you're supposed to have 'learnt' this bit, > by now...!!).
> 'B9' would indicate mastered Feb 59 - A9 =Jan 1959 - so both LPs could > be in copyright!
> My other early DGG SLPM gatefolds carry date/location, BTW..
Why don't you find someone to report this to???? You are like the kid in the shoolyard who used to snitch on the other kids. I'm sure you would feel better if you did. Wagner fan
frankwm wrote: >> But hey, frankwm, when have you ever missed an opportunity to knock our >> releases, one way or another?
> 'Just The Facts, Ma'am'....
> If you look inside your copy of 138 014, and upon reading the text, > you will see the recording location/date shown..betcha.. > Also - check on the matrix (you're supposed to have 'learnt' this bit, > by now...!!).
> 'B9' would indicate mastered Feb 59 - A9 =Jan 1959 - so both LPs could > be in copyright!
> My other early DGG SLPM gatefolds carry date/location, BTW..
138 014 is stamped M8 - what does this signify?
-- Andrew Rose
Pristine Classical: "The destination for people interested in historic recordings..." (Gramophone)
On 7 Nov, 06:02, Andrew Rose <and...@pristineaudio.com> wrote:
> 138 014 is stamped M8 - what does this signify?
That it was mastered in December 1958. But, with copyright in mind, does that signify 'date of publication'? [The other letter you will see, at right-angles, is an A-Z pressing sequence. The engineers 'moniker' can also appear (not on my copy of 139 015 though)]. Presumably you found the recording location/date in the sleeve-note? (Brahms: Kempff recital (139 010) /Janacek Qt-Bernathova ~Piano Qnt (139 009) also recorded @ that location - but slightly earlier)
As you take some care in avoiding copyright material then it does seem an 'oversight' given the information pretty readily- to-hand, and my 'assumption' is that nowhere did either LP have a 1958 commercial release; not really surprising given that 'August 1958' was recording date...
However..if you're waiting until you receive a 'cease-and-desist' from Universal (..............)
frankwm wrote: > On 7 Nov, 06:02, Andrew Rose <and...@pristineaudio.com> wrote: >> 138 014 is stamped M8 - what does this signify?
> That it was mastered in December 1958. > But, with copyright in mind, does that signify 'date of publication'? > [The other letter you will see, at right-angles, is an A-Z pressing > sequence. The engineers 'moniker' can also appear (not on my copy of > 139 015 though)]. > Presumably you found the recording location/date in the sleeve-note? > (Brahms: Kempff recital (139 010) /Janacek Qt-Bernathova ~Piano Qnt > (139 009) also recorded @ that location - but slightly earlier)
> As you take some care in avoiding copyright material then it does seem > an 'oversight' given the information pretty readily- to-hand, and my > 'assumption' is that nowhere did either LP have a 1958 commercial > release; not really surprising given that 'August 1958' was recording > date...
I must admit I hadn't read the sleevenotes for this - I'll make a decision on what to do in the next few days. Many thanks for your assistance in decoding these stamps - it's not something I have any reference material on.
-- Andrew Rose
Pristine Classical: "The destination for people interested in historic recordings..." (Gramophone)
> frankwm wrote: > > On 7 Nov, 06:02, Andrew Rose <and...@pristineaudio.com> wrote: > >> 138 014 is stamped M8 - what does this signify?
> > That it was mastered in December 1958. > > But, with copyright in mind, does that signify 'date of publication'? > > [The other letter you will see, at right-angles, is an A-Z pressing > > sequence. The engineers 'moniker' can also appear (not on my copy of > > 139 015 though)]. > > Presumably you found the recording location/date in the sleeve-note? > > (Brahms: Kempff recital (139 010) /Janacek Qt-Bernathova ~Piano Qnt > > (139 009) also recorded @ that location - but slightly earlier)
> > As you take some care in avoiding copyright material then it does seem > > an 'oversight' given the information pretty readily- to-hand, and my > > 'assumption' is that nowhere did either LP have a 1958 commercial > > release; not really surprising given that 'August 1958' was recording > > date...
> I must admit I hadn't read the sleevenotes for this - I'll make a > decision on what to do in the next few days. Many thanks for your > assistance in decoding these stamps - it's not something I have any > reference material on.
Now perhaps you would use your ears, where reference material is supposed to exist, and tell us why this reissue is of any interest to anyone but you and your banker.
frankwm wrote: > On 7 Nov, 06:02, Andrew Rose <and...@pristineaudio.com> wrote: >> 138 014 is stamped M8 - what does this signify?
> That it was mastered in December 1958. > But, with copyright in mind, does that signify 'date of publication'? > [The other letter you will see, at right-angles, is an A-Z pressing > sequence. The engineers 'moniker' can also appear (not on my copy of > 139 015 though)]. > Presumably you found the recording location/date in the sleeve-note? > (Brahms: Kempff recital (139 010) /Janacek Qt-Bernathova ~Piano Qnt > (139 009) also recorded @ that location - but slightly earlier)
> As you take some care in avoiding copyright material then it does seem > an 'oversight' given the information pretty readily- to-hand, and my > 'assumption' is that nowhere did either LP have a 1958 commercial > release; not really surprising given that 'August 1958' was recording > date...
> However..if you're waiting until you receive a 'cease-and-desist' from > Universal (..............)
Thanks again for pointing this out and for the decoding of DGG dates, which I was previously unaware of - they're not recordings we often work from and I have little accurate discographical information for them.
I've this morning withdrawn these Santoliquido recordings from sale - though the website still carries information about them the purchase buttons have been removed and a note added to the effect that they will be restored to our catalogue on 1st January 2010.
-- Andrew Rose
Pristine Classical: "The destination for people interested in historic recordings..." (Gramophone)
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